Oral History Interview with
Seventeen year veteran with the Associated Press. Later news editor and acting managing editor of the Providence (Rhode Island) Journal-Bulletin, after which he served in the White House as liaison for the press-radio division of the Office of Inter-American Affairs. In January, 1945, he became part of the White House staff as a press officer until he retired at the end of the Truman administration.
Eben A. Ayers
February 1, 1967
Jerry N. Hess
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This is a transcript of a tape-recorded interview conducted for the Harry S. Truman Library. A draft of this transcript was edited by the interviewee but only minor emendations were made; therefore, the reader should remember that this is essentially a transcript of the spoken, rather than the written word.
Numbers appearing in square brackets (ex. ) within the transcript indicate the pagination in the original, hardcopy version of the oral history interview.
This oral history transcript may be read, quoted from, cited, and reproduced for purposes of research. It may not be published in full except by permission of the Harry S. Truman Library.
Opened August, 1972
Harry S. Truman Library
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Oral History Interview with
February 1, 1967
Jerry N. Hess
HESS: Mr. Ayers, at the end of our last interview we had mentioned Mr. Joseph Short, and I know that it was shortly after he came in that you left the press office and became special assistant in the White House office. I'd like to ask you a few questions concerning him anyway. Did he carry out the functions of the press office in any significantly different manner than Mr. Ross had done?
AYERS: That's a little difficult for me to answer because I left the office almost immediately after Short came in and I think that perhaps my impression would be about all that I can give on that. My impression is that the office operated technically about as it had with its predecessors. Whether the changes he made could be characterized as significant or not, I'm not sure, but he did make some changes. When I left the office, which, as I say, was within a few days after he came in; in fact, immediately after he came in; he'd brought in two men in my place: Mr. Roger Tubby, and Mr. Irving Perlmeter. Now, I don't know from anything that was said to me what his purpose was, but my understanding, arrived at from observation as much as anything, was that Mr. Tubby, who had been in the press office at the State Department, was
brought in probably to afford a closer relationship with foreign affairs than the press secretary might normally have. Perimeter's work was never explained to me beyond the fact that he was an assistant to Short, presumably doing whatever Short might ask him to do. Now, as to the operation of the office under Short, as compared with that of his predecessors, I think there was a difference. I think that Short, perhaps, was more inclined to feel himself as more of a policy adviser than either Charlie Ross or even Steve Early. I had no specific knowledge of that other than the way it seemed to operate from my observation on the outside. He, I believe, spoke up more positively for the President at times than Charlie Ross would have, or I would have, or most of the others would have who preceded him. There isn't much beyond that that I could say about Short's operation of the office. There were some incidents which I wouldn't want to go into, because I don't know the background enough of them. I had no direct relations with him in the work that I was doing for the President, except on one or two occasions and that was very slight. I thought that once or twice he got a little bit overly excited about something. That happened on one occasion in the case of a magazine article that was published in a small magazine
which attacked Mr. Truman and his career in Kansas City. It was, oh, a violent thing. I hadn't seen it until, I think the President called me in, or I was in there, and he brought it up to me. And I said that I didn't think that he should pay any attention to those things and he agreed with me. But it had been brought to his attention by Mr. Short, who, apparently, wanted to make some kind of an answer. I don't know that that was said specifically, but the President did say to me, "Eben, I wish you would go out to Kansas City and look into the whole thing yourself. All I want you to do is go out there and get the facts. And we'll have that for the record."
And I said, "Very well, I will."
And I did. I spent several days out there and I put together what I found. It has never been used or published, and insofar as I know has never been disclosed to anyone. But it was a purely factual, objective piece of reporting that I did. We never took any recognition of the magazine article which Short was so excited about. What he may have told Short about it, I don't know.
HESS: On that subject, whom did you talk to out in Kansas City?
AYERS: I talked to quite a number of people; business concerns,
with which the firm of Truman and Jacobson had done business, in their period as haberdashers in Kansas City when the depression forced them to the wall. This article implied, as I recall, I may be a little bit hazy about some of the details of the article, but it implied that they didn't pay their debts, or something like that. I saw several of the creditors, every one of whom told me that they paid up everything. Then there was more about banks, bank loan, or something. I checked with the bank and the head of the bank, who, incidentally, I think, was a Republican, but who went out of his way to see whether they had the records, and they found that they did have them from the beginning. And I could see them, and it showed where they paid every cent before they got through, at times making the smallest kind of payments--but they cleared that up. That was the sort of thing--I won't go into details about it because it was done confidentially and I feel it is still a matter of confidence.
HESS: Mr. Truman probably still has his copy at the Library.
This is a question that we've mentioned in one of the previous interviews, but there are several topics that arise from Elmer Cornwell's book, Presidential Leadership of Public Opinion, and I know he interviewed you before
he wrote that book, and he has many references to you and of that interview, so we don't want to duplicate what he has covered there, but I think we can and should enlarge upon a few of the things that he mentions. And one of the statements is something that we have already hit on, but I thought you might want to enlarge on it a bit, and that is that it was your contention that if Charlie Ross had lived, the President's prestige would not have fallen as low after 1950 as it did. Why did you feel that way?
AYERS: I haven't seen that book and just how he may have quoted me. But I undoubtedly said that because I have said it on several occasions. I don't think I would say it as a contention, merely as an opinion, which, quite possibly, is a little biased. But I did say, and have said, that I felt had Charlie lived, the President's prestige wouldn't have fallen quite as low as it did. There were other factors that entered in, many that probably would have affected his standing in the polls. As it does with every President, his popularity goes in cycles, and President Truman's probably would have fallen. But I had the feeling, and have had the feeling, that it wouldn't have been quite as low, not that Charlie Ross or I consciously made a very strong effort--in a phraseology
that's used so much these days--of trying to present a better "image," but it could have been handled a little better we thought, or I thought, at least. I, as I say, I may be a little biased. Maybe it would have been as low as it was, but it seemed to me things might have been smoothed out a little now and then, in all honesty, without trying to color things too much . For that reason, he probably would have had a somewhat better standing than he did have. I think it was allowed to deteriorate by people who knew that he was not going to run again, and they didn't care as much as they might have. Again, I may be wrong.
HESS: A question on Mr. Ross. He was sick off and on, and I believe he was in the hospital in the months of October and November of 1945. Did all of the work of the press office fall on you, or did you get any assistance from any of the other staff members of the White House?
AYERS: No, I didn't. If I were sick at any time, for a day or so or something, anything like that, then I usually called on Hassett who had served in that office and he would fill in for a day or a couple of days. But otherwise, on a day to day operation, no. I had no help. The only help I had was the secretarial help that we had in the office, the stenographers and typists. And my
feeling is that no others were necessary. Correspondence might pile up a little bit more, but handling the day to day operations I don't think was affected. I never felt there was need for anybody else. I was very much surprised, in fact, when I left the office and two men were brought in in my place.
HESS: Do we have anything we want to add on Charlie Ross; anything about his particular relationships with the President; anything that comes to mind?
AYERS: Not particularly, offhand. I think it was a very fine relationship, I'm sure, because of their background, the fact that they were together in high school, although I don't think they were particularly intimate at the time, but, of course, they were, I guess, in the same class, they had the same teacher, and if you'll recall, when Charlie accepted the job, he called the teacher and both he and the President spoke to her. And I think that that relationship grew closer during Charlie's service as press secretary. I know that there were times when the President called him in on certain things that were policy matters.