Tom L. Evans Oral History Interview, December 19, 1963

Notice
This is a transcript of a tape-recorded interview conducted for the Harry S. Truman Library. A draft of this transcript was edited by the interviewee but only minor emendations were made; therefore, the reader should remember that this is essentially a transcript of the spoken, rather than the written word.

Numbers appearing in square brackets (ex. [45]) within the transcript indicate the pagination in the original, hardcopy version of the oral history interview.

RESTRICTIONS
This oral history transcript may be read, quoted from, cited, and reproduced for purposes of research. It may not be published in full except by permission of the Harry S. Truman Library.

Opened August, 1966
Harry S. Truman Library
Independence, Missouri

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FUCHS: In 1952, there was some talk of drafting the President when he left the White House to run again for the Senate. Do you recall anything about that and did he ever mention it to you?

EVANS: Oh yes, a number of people mentioned it. My guess is that half of his friends were for it and half of them were bitterly opposed to it. I happened to be the one that was bitterly opposed to it. I think, actually--unless it's purely a guess on my part--I think, actually, President Truman would have liked very much to have been returned to the Senate of the United States, because that's where he enjoyed himself, and enjoyed the work more than anything that he had ever done. It is my personal opinion that Mrs. Truman was opposed to it and that is probably why he didn't, but I simply was opposed to it

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because you don't go down in the political ladder and he had reached the peak, so why go down. He had earned a rest. In my opinion, he wanted very much to go back.

FUCHS: Do you talk to him about it?

EVANS: Oh, yes, quite often when we were having lunch, and as you well know, we had lunch almost every day together, and we'd talk about it. But he never made definite statements to me that he did want to go back, but we'd talk about it, but more or less, around in circles without coming right out.

FUCHS: In 1954, Mr. Truman went to Westminster College in Fulton, Missouri, to speak. I believe it was a John Finley Green lecture that he was invited to give there, Do you recall that journey? I believe you went with him.

EVANS: Yes, I went with him and his old friend, Harry Jobes, went with him, and Judge Caskie Collett.

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It seems to me that Eddie Jacobson was with us, but 1 couldn't be sure. Anyway, I went with him. I know the President stayed at the banker's house down there, and we stayed at somebody else's house--we, Harry Jobes and I, I remember.

FUCHS: Who was the banker?

EVANS: He was on our board, too, of the Harry S. Truman Library, Inc. It was Tom Van Sant, the banker. Incidentally, I don't think this has any place in history about Tom Van Sant, but it was a peculiar story. We would hold the annual meeting of the Harry S. Truman Library, Inc., here in my office at 125 East 31st Street each year. And Dave Lloyd would prepare the notices and sent them out to all the trustees, which is in excess of a hundred, with a form of proxy to sign. Dave would always write a letter and say it was just a formality and nothing particular at all was coming up except the election of trustees and the same officers, and it's not necessary for you to

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show up, but we'd appreciate you signing proxy. We always had those meetings on a Saturday. I never come to the office on Saturday. This particular Saturday, the telephone operator at the office called me at home and said, "Mr. Evans, you're supposed to be having a meeting, is that right?"

I said, "Yes, there's supposed to be a meeting, but there isn't anybody supposed to be there. Why?"

And she said, "Mr. Van Sant from Fulton is here for the meeting?"

I said, "Oh, my, let me talk to him."

So, he got on the phone and I said, "Well, Tom, I just didn't come down because I didn't think anybody would be there; it's a formality."

And he said, "That's all right, don’t worry about it. I just wanted to get away and come up to the city and see the sights and this was a good excuse."

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FUCHS: How did they get acquainted, do you know?

EVANS: No, I don't. I think many, many years.

FUCHS: Anything else in connection with the trip to Westminster?

EVANS: I don't think anything particular that I can think of.

FUCHS: In 1956, the Democratic National Convention was in Chicago. Did you take a part?

EVANS: Yes, Mrs. Evans and I went up on the train with President and Mrs. Truman and had rooms adjoining with them at the Blackstone Hotel. What particularly did you want to know about that?

FUCHS: Well., what about Mr, Truman's conversations might have been in regard to his support of the candidates and did you see eye to eye with him; were you in support of Harriman or did you think he should of stuck with Stevenson?

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EVANS: I always see eye to eye with President Truman regardless of what it is, unless he gives me permission like he did in the Bolling situation, to be opposed to him. To be perfectly honest, I didn't have my heart in being opposed to Stevenson as the President was, and I would say, "Why be opposed to Mr. Stevenson?"

And he said, "Because four years ago when I was in the White House, I had him in and he agreed that he would be delighted to have the nomination. I considered that it was all closed and then he adopted the attitude of 'hard to get"'--this is Mr. Truman's statement--"and I just didn't like that kind of attitude" (Mr. Truman speaking), "and he had has chance and I just felt that Mr. Harriman was better qualified and I promised him my support." I think Mr. Harriman, whom I know very well and he's a wonderful fellow, at that convention he didn't make too much of an impression on the delegates that were there. But that was quite a hectic convention.

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FUCHS: You say, Mr. Truman, when he first had Stevenson in did get Stevenson's acquiescence and then he later backtracked?

EVANS: Or acted hard--he didn't know whether he wanted it or not and he wanted to be more or less drafted, was, I believe, the way Mr. Truman put it. And he just didn't like that.

FUCHS: What about Senator [Estes] Kefauver? Did you favor him as a candidate?

EVANS: No, I personally never favored him, because of Mr. Truman, mainly. I know Senator Kefauver broke his word with Mr. Truman on a Congressional hearing that was being held throughout the country, headed by Kefauver. He was coming to Kansas City and he promised Mr. Truman that he wasn't going to do anything, and he liked the publicity (I'm speaking about Kefauver) so well that he came to Kansas City and got into every phase in the world, anything to get publicity. In other words, just absolutely broke his word with President Truman.

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So after that, why, I personally never had any use for him and neither did President Truman; I know that.

FUCHS: What was the basis of this? Did Mr. Truman just feel that he shouldn't "stir up the animals," so to speak, in Kansas City at that particular time?

EVANS: No, that wasn't the idea of it. The idea being that Kefauver wanted to come in and investigate things that there was no rhyme or reason for at all, mainly just to create publicity, as he had done in other cities. And Mr. Truman said, "There's no reason, going out to Kansas City, which adjoins my home town of Independence, and creating all that furor."

And he said, "I don't intend to, and I wont, and I assure you that it won't happen," and then he came out and did just exactly that, by investigating and asking questions about things that,

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in my opinion, there was never anything to, and far from what he was supposed to be doing. And he would bring in names of many of the President's close friends who were not involved in any manner, shape or form, but only to create publicity, in my opinion.

FUCHS: There is a reference in your papers in 1956 to a "Potsdam watch," which you had and Mr. Talge was supposed to get engraved for you. Can you tell me what that was?

EVANS: Yes, when President Truman was at the Potsdam Conference, they gave him a watch, as many people did throughout the world. And after he came out of the White House? I don’t know the year--do you say ‘56--I was thinking it was earlier than that, but, anyway, I went with him down to his vault, to his safe deposit box for some reason, I've forgotten what. I think it was probably to get a paper for his lawyer or something; and he

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said, "I want you to go because I've got a lot of watches down there and they're not doing anybody any good and I'm giving them away. I've given my nephews--each one of my nephews"--it seems to me that he had about fifteen or sixteen--"and some of my friends, and I want you to have one."

And I went down and, Jim, I swear there were still twenty-five or thirty watches in that save deposit box, and he said, "You pick out the one you want."

And I said, "I'll take any one you want to give me."

And he said, "Well, they’ve all got a little history," and he picked one up and he said, "This one was given me" (I've forgotten by whom) "at the Potsdam Conference." And he proceeded to tell me all about it. It did practically everything except tell the time. It gave the moon automatically, the day of the week, the day of the month, incidentally,

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in a foreign language, and as I say, almost everything, except tell time. Of course, it did tell time, but it was hard to see. And then it was a stop watch and there was a second hand and a little small hand called a five-second hand. Oh, there was more gadgets on it and one time we were having--after I'd gotten this watch--I never actually wore it except maybe when my regular watch happened to be in the shop.

FUCHS: Was it a wristwatch?

EVANS: Oh yes, but real big, thick--too thick for comfort because of all these gadgets on it. It had an alarm--oh, just various and sundry things, a wonderful watch.

FUCHS: Was it a gold watch?

EVANS: Yes. Anyway, I was to a lunch where Henry Talge was, and I happened to have this watch on and I was showing it around because of the Latin terms. It gave the day of the week and the month of the

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year on it, and they were putting it in English, some of them there, and anyway, I remember Henry Talge said, "Well, it's all right, you can tell people where you got it, but you'd never made anybody believe it. You ought to have it engraved and have the Boss's signature."

And I said, "How can I get his signature?"

And so we got a piece of paper--I've forgotten what it said--but Mr. Truman wrote in his own handwriting: "This watch given to me at Potsdam Conference on such-and-such a date and I'm giving it to my friend, Tom Evans," and signed his name. And Talge had that reduced down and put on the watch. So, I have the watch and, of course, with that engraved on the back. You've never seen it?

FUCHS: No.

EVANS: I'm sorry I haven't got i